So I expanded my palate through dedicated mewing for 2 or 3 mm (39-41/42 intermolar distance) . I am happy with the results, I see some positve facial changes. But now I have a very slightly uncomfortable feeling biting, because my back molars stand a bit more out and doesn't fit the lower molars (who definetely didn't adapt in distance in the last months) as good as before ,I think, but maybe I am wrong. Can somebody have a look at the pictures. I am afraid that more expansion would mess up my bite, maybe 42mm distance is my limit?
So I expanded my palate through dedicated mewing for 2 or 3 mm (39-41/42 intermolar distance) . I am happy with the results, I see some positve facial changes. But now I have a very slightly uncomfortable feeling biting, because my back molars stand a bit more out and doesn't fit the lower molars (who definetely didn't adapt in distance in the last months) as good as before ,I think, but maybe I am wrong. Can somebody have a look at the pictures. I am afraid that more expansion would mess up my bite, maybe 42mm distance is my limit?
edit: somehow I wasn't able to upload more than one picture, so the rest is here:
https://imgur.com/a/VK0y1Yd
https://imgur.com/a/mvFXGen
Have you tried jutting your jaw forward? That in and of itself can probably fix your problem since it would make the mandible adjust to the new position.
Mike Mew also mentions how temporary maloclussion may occur with expansion .This apparently is a common problem
This is so interesting, I just sent an email to Dr. Mew asking about this same topic. I will let you know if he replies but I will share with you now what I could observe from looking at your pictures.
It seems your lower molars are tipped inward. If this is the case then it's usually just a matter of time before they adjust upward. They obviously need more time as there is no pressure being applied to them, rather only indirectly when you chew your food.
Another scenario is that you over expanded, but I am not sure how that could be possible with the tongue alone. Usually Dr. Mew expands the upper arch to 44mm then retains it for 2 years before removing the appliance completely. Most people experience some degree of relapse in the upper arch afterwards. Those that keep an inter molar width at or above 38mm succeed in their orthtropic treatment.
One last observation, it seems your top incisors might be retroinclined. If so, that could be causing you lower jaw to sit behind the upper jaw effectively making the arch smaller in relation to the upper.
my story: http://www.aljabri.com/blog/my-story/
The lower molars are tipped in quite a lot. I expect that chewing will make the bite align over time, but have no reason to suppose it will be the lower molars doing all the adapting rather than vice versa, or most likely a compromise being reached between the two. Why not tip the lower molars out by holding your tongue in position between them just as you have done with the upper molars?
The lower molars are tipped in quite a lot. I expect that chewing will make the bite align over time, but have no reason to suppose it will be the lower molars doing all the adapting rather than vice versa, or most likely a compromise being reached between the two. Why not tip the lower molars out by holding your tongue in position between them just as you have done with the upper molars?
So are you suggesting tongue on mouth floor posture (lower arch/mandible) for the time being to "correct " the problem?
I will say that I used to rest my tongue there and it didn't really do much for the lower arch width tbh
The lower molars are tipped in quite a lot. I expect that chewing will make the bite align over time, but have no reason to suppose it will be the lower molars doing all the adapting rather than vice versa, or most likely a compromise being reached between the two. Why not tip the lower molars out by holding your tongue in position between them just as you have done with the upper molars?
This won't work, especially at such an early stage, because the newly expanded upper arch needs support to remain in position. Otherwise it would regress back to where it started.
As for the compromise, this is usually what ends up happening after retention is removed. The lower arch expands to match the upper until it reaches the limit and once retention is removed the upper shrinks to make up for the difference.
my story: http://www.aljabri.com/blog/my-story/
“So are you suggesting tongue on mouth floor posture (lower arch/mandible) for the time being to "correct " the problem?
I will say that I used to rest my tongue there and it didn't really do much for the lower arch width tbh”
No. I am suggesting between the teeth somewhat higher up than that. OP does not need to expand his mandible and I do not suggest it would work if that was the objective. He needs to tip his teeth out. I know we are encouraged to be fearful of pushing on the teeth, but I think it is a reasonable approach to tipping teeth if done with some skill and caution. I do not suggest that he wholly neglects holding his tongue on the roof of the palate, but adds this to it. I have not experienced much of automatic catching up of the teeth of the mandible to expansion in the maxilla, but I have felt what I would describe as a willingness to catch up. It does not seem incautious to me to apply pressure half way up the teeth. Pressure might be applied by nothing much more than consciously occupying the space fully with the tongue and seeking to hold it as far forwards as possible. This would be a very different thing to letting it rest passsively in the bottom of the mouth.
Have you tried jutting your jaw forward? That in and of itself can probably fix your problem since it would make the mandible adjust to the new position.
Mike Mew also mentions how temporary maloclussion may occur with expansion .This apparently is a common problem
I can't jut my jaw forward because my lower front teeth are directly behind my upper front teeth. If I want to jut my jaw forward I have to open my bite quite a bit and can't mew properly
This is so interesting, I just sent an email to Dr. Mew asking about this same topic. I will let you know if he replies but I will share with you now what I could observe from looking at your pictures.
It seems your lower molars are tipped inward. If this is the case then it's usually just a matter of time before they adjust upward. They obviously need more time as there is no pressure being applied to them, rather only indirectly when you chew your food.
Another scenario is that you over expanded, but I am not sure how that could be possible with the tongue alone. Usually Dr. Mew expands the upper arch to 44mm then retains it for 2 years before removing the appliance completely. Most people experience some degree of relapse in the upper arch afterwards. Those that keep an inter molar width at or above 38mm succeed in their orthtropic treatment.
One last observation, it seems your top incisors might be retroinclined. If so, that could be causing you lower jaw to sit behind the upper jaw effectively making the arch smaller in relation to the upper.
That would be awesome if you could let me know if Mike answers, thanks :)
You guys did very good observations, my back molars are in fact tipped inward quite strongly, I actually never realised. Maybe if there is no automatic catch up from the back molars I might try to thump pull them to tip out a bit more?
For your last observation Abdulrahman, my front incissors tip inward, yes. I always had the feeling if I close my bite, my lower front teeth (and with that the whole jaw) get pushed back and would sith further in front if the upper incissors would offer them more space. Can one change something about the retroinclined front teeth? The following link is another picture of them tipping inward.
Thanks a ton to all of you guys taking your time and answering
That would be awesome if you could let me know if Mike answers, thanks :)
You guys did very good observations, my back molars are in fact tipped inward quite strongly, I actually never realised. Maybe if there is no automatic catch up from the back molars I might try to thump pull them to tip out a bit more?
For your last observation Abdulrahman, my front incissors tip inward, yes. I always had the feeling if I close my bite, my lower front teeth (and with that the whole jaw) get pushed back and would sith further in front if the upper incissors would offer them more space. Can one change something about the retroinclined front teeth? The following link is another picture of them tipping inward.
Thanks a ton to all of you guys taking your time and answering
I don't think thumb pulling will do much. There are allot of people who tried it for months and didn't get results. It's just not constant enough to promote movement, but it does not hurt trying. Maybe before and after food.
Your incisors are retoinclined and are blocking you lower jaw from moving forward to it's ideal closing position. You might also have a narrow inter canine width which is very common with this condition.
Looking at all those 3 conditions together your tongue alone can't fix them. I think you would benefit from using clear aligners such as Invisalign to correct them.
The treatment is mild but pricey compared to braces. The good news is that your teeth area already looking pretty good so you don't need a full course, no elastics or anything complicated, just small finishing touches.
my story: http://www.aljabri.com/blog/my-story/
I don't think thumb pulling will do much. There are allot of people who tried it for months and didn't get results. It's just not constant enough to promote movement, but it does not hurt trying. Maybe before and after food.
Your incisors are retoinclined and are blocking you lower jaw from moving forward to it's ideal closing position. You might also have a narrow inter canine width which is very common with this condition.
Looking at all those 3 conditions together your tongue alone can't fix them. I think you would benefit from using clear aligners such as Invisalign to correct them.
The treatment is mild but pricey compared to braces. The good news is that your teeth area already looking pretty good so you don't need a full course, no elastics or anything complicated, just small finishing touches.
Alright, thanks for the great feedback :) unfortunately I have no money at all, but maybe in a few years I can get aligners haha
I've posted a lot about trying to upright my lingually tipped lower molars. In the past, my upper arch was narrower than my lower arch, so the tilting of my lower molars prevented cross bite. After expanding my maxillary intermolar width to a little over 39mm, my arches are now about the same width. I think chewing might help induce the lower teeth to adjust to my new occlusion. I've also been using a large myobrace A2 for a little over one month. I get some achiness in my lower molars when I take out the mouthpiece in the morning, which might be a sign that they are uprighting. However, I doubt that the adult large size of the myobrace would fit anyone whose intermolar width is wider than mine.
The lower molars are tipped in quite a lot. I expect that chewing will make the bite align over time, but have no reason to suppose it will be the lower molars doing all the adapting rather than vice versa, or most likely a compromise being reached between the two. Why not tip the lower molars out by holding your tongue in position between them just as you have done with the upper molars?
So are you suggesting tongue on mouth floor posture (lower arch/mandible) for the time being to "correct " the problem?
I will say that I used to rest my tongue there and it didn't really do much for the lower arch width tbh
When you are mewing, the side of the tongue is also touching the side of the molars in the mandible. Ppl assume they need a lot of force to move the teeth, but that isn't true. Proper mewing posture should straighten mandible molars as well, because teeth move away from the pressure the side of the tongue exerts on them, which does not have to be much, just consistent.
I noticed this when I started mewing and discovered there was cement left on the inside of my left back molar (mandible) from braces. It scraped the side of my tongue raw from mewing, till I went to my dentist and and he removed the cement. Before mewing I didn't even notice that there was cement there, guess why.
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