When I do the cheesy smile swallow, I feel the posterior tongue press against the soft palate. With effort, I can keep the tongue seated in that position for a few minutes at most. At rest, I'm still not able to maintain that level of engagement with my posterior 1/3, but that's what I've thought of as my goal which I assume would be easier to hold if I had more tongue space. Simultaneously, I also feel some level of lateral/horizontal pressure against the alveolar ridges, especially on my left side which is deviated closer to my midline.

This thread might be relevant:  /community/community/main-forum/pushing-up-against-the-suture-ridge-in-the-mouth-vs-pushing-out-against-the-molars/

I noticed this mewing thing is a skill like any other, and the more I do it, the better I am at finding the best position that doesn't strain my tongue so much, but gives proper posture. At first I was only able to do 1 of the things you mentioned, but now I am doing them simultaneously , and it even feels more comfortable in doing so than only 1 thing. Only struggle I have at the moment is similar to apollo's, my palate is narrow and asymmetrically deviated, where the left side of my palate is higher, and the teeth and palate on the right side is more deviated closer to the midline. So when I apply these forces the tongue is a bit twisted and doesn't have as much room on the right side, sometimes it even hurts as its pressed so hard against the teeth on the right.

Now in relation , I was asking myself this: if I am applying uneven forces with my tongue every day, alot of the time, can this have some kind of negative effects regarding muscle tone in the tongue itself, neck, and even the masseter... as my tongue is needed to generate more force on 1 side, does that mean the masseter on that side is also compensating with more force. Or the general goal and idea is all this will just eventually center my skull and then the forces will even out.

Posted by: Fika

I noticed this mewing thing is a skill like any other, and the more I do it, the better I am at finding the best position that doesn't strain my tongue so much, but gives proper posture. At first I was only able to do 1 of the things you mentioned, but now I am doing them simultaneously , and it even feels more comfortable in doing so than only 1 thing. Only struggle I have at the moment is similar to apollo's, my palate is narrow and asymmetrically deviated, where the left side of my palate is higher, and the teeth and palate on the right side is more deviated closer to the midline. So when I apply these forces the tongue is a bit twisted and doesn't have as much room on the right side, sometimes it even hurts as its pressed so hard against the teeth on the right.

Now in relation , I was asking myself this: if I am applying uneven forces with my tongue every day, alot of the time, can this have some kind of negative effects regarding muscle tone in the tongue itself, neck, and even the masseter... as my tongue is needed to generate more force on 1 side, does that mean the masseter on that side is also compensating with more force. Or the general goal and idea is all this will just eventually center my skull and then the forces will even out.

My situation is very similar. I think the asymmetrical shape & position of the palate will affect your whole spinal posture until you learn to use the surrounding musculature to actively compensate for it. In the very least, your neck and jaw have to be sufficiently firm to serve as a balanced base from which the tongue can push towards the right direction. Likewise, if you are simply positioning your tongue so that it sits evenly in the asymmetrically positioned palate, your progress will probably continue, but your asymmetry may not be affected at all.

Does it seem hard for you guys to determine the actual weaker side of your asymmetrically developed & deviated palate? Or the face itself? I change my opinion of my own facial asymmetry constantly. It's like both sides have their own indicators of asymmetry and lack of development that I can either see or feel: unevenly wide and canted dental arches, nose where the septum deviates to one side and the tip of the nose to the opposite side, horizontally and vertically uneven cheekbones, uneven eyes, mandible tilted to one side etc.

All of these seem to be mixed together and contradicting each other in a way that doesn't much sense. To mind comes the video by Mew where a crumbled paper was straightened out as an analogy for how palatal expansion resolves the facial asymmetry. Perhaps it would be useful to just push somewhere with the tongue and see which direction results in the best physical sensations.

Likewise, if you are simply positioning your tongue so that it sits evenly in the asymmetrically positioned palate, your progress will probably continue, but your asymmetry may not be affected at all.

Well non active mewing is meh anyway, when I push my tongue on my palate actively, its impossible for me not to push the right side more, hence I believe my asymmetry is being fixed, well for me the situation is a bit more complex due to uneven number of teeth on both sides... and this  boogles me on what to do, I explained it in the thread I posted.

Does it seem hard for you guys to determine the actual weaker side of your asymmetrically developed & deviated palate? Or the face itself? I change my opinion of my own facial asymmetry constantly. It's like both sides have their own indicators of asymmetry and lack of development that I can either see or feel: unevenly wide and canted dental arches, nose where the septum deviates to one side and the tip of the nose to the opposite side, horizontally and vertically uneven cheekbones, uneven eyes, mandible tilted to one side etc.

All of these seem to be mixed together and contradicting each other in a way that doesn't much sense. To mind comes the video by Mew where a crumbled paper was straightened out as an analogy for how palatal expansion resolves the facial asymmetry. Perhaps it would be useful to just push somewhere with the tongue and see which direction results in the best physical sensations.

I don't have problems to determine, my case is pretty obvious, but I think even if you can't determine, you should just follow what mew said here  https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=180&v=6diTUU5mca8, he doesn't say exactly about asymmetry, but I recon it's the right way to think about it, not to think where I need to push, but just use my tongue as a balloon to expand everything, naturally people with asymmetry will encounter asymmetrycal resistances, but just keep pushing that balloon as it will gradually even out things. I guess what I want to say is, when you feel more resistance somewhere, don't push anything extra there... just push everywhere and let that place be under more forces naturally.

Yes, that makes sense.

I spent some time experimenting with various postures again. One technique that seems like a more convenient way to achieve the maximal tongue engagement that the current palatal structure allows than the cheesy smile method, is to

1. assume proper head posture by chin tuck / biting downward against the mandible

2. attempt to exhale trough nose and use this motion to allow the whole tongue down from the base of the neck to rise against the walls of the mouth in a 3D manner, until the tongue obstructs the whole airway and is plastered across the soft tissue.

3. ease  just a bit until you can properly breathe, but without allowing the tongue to fall down.

Is this what you meant by using the tongue as a balloon @Fika? Blowing the tongue into the upper throat like a balloon? By playing around with  neck & shoulder activation in this position and ensuring that the whole musculature is activating in balance, it definitely seems that the bone will have no other option than to start adapt to the musculature that is striving towards symmetry, as you say. I'd also be interested in hearing how attempting this kind of exercise turns out for a tongue tied person like you @gjenopp

Mewing is slowly starting to feel like some kind of bizarre spiritual practice. Ever since I started developing my proper tongue posture over 2 years ago, I've been having monthly realizations "Oh so THIS is what a proper posture is like", only to later understand how lacking it still was. It feels akin to chasing an elusive form of enlightenment that is constantly progressed towards but never reached. Every week I feel like I'm finally about to start making some real progress. Then next week I think that again. Of course, I HAVE progressed in these two years. But not enough to feel like I have become worthy for my username yet

Perhaps the constantly occuring subtle structural change and subsequent increased intuitiviness regarding the proper posture is also playing into this illusion.

I didn't mean anything strictly structural by my words, so no it wasn't what I meant. I meant the balloon and dominos analogy being simply visual on how physics works, physics laws that can be applied in the mouth too. When I mew I tend to feel and visualize more than think what I'm doing in a strict way, as over analyzing breaks my concentration of the practice itself.