Hello, I'm a 19 yr old male and I've started mewing about 4 months ago and since then I had a lot of questions about things I've personally found weird or abstract during that period. So, I'd like to get some help from you guys so I don't * my face up. I can't yet analyze my face completely, but I'm pretty sure my one side of the face is underdeveloped (pushed back maxilla on the left side of the face?), my other side is fine tho. I have a pretty long face too with a crooked big nose (not the biggest but yeah, considerably big). I've worn my braces for 2 years and I believe that they narrowed my upper jaw because I'm not yet sure if my whole tongue fits there (I measured intermolar width on my retainers and it's 40mm if I'm not wrong). My posture was really bad since high school, my head came forward a lot which I guess made my face so long in the end. I was also a mouth breather for god knows how many years.
To sum things up. 19 yr old, bad body posture, forward head posture, long face, vertical grown, mouth breather, braces...
What have I changed in the last 4 months?
- Started sitting properly everywhere, especially in my chair in which I sit most of the day
- Started putting my tongue on the roof of my mouth combined with lips together and teeth slightly touching
- Started practicing mew swallow
- Started breathing through my mouth
- Stopped wearing orthodontic appliances (removable retainer)
What facial changes have I noticed?
- To be fair I haven't noticed much, of course, there are some subtle things that I'm pretty sure have changed. For example, my upper has expanded a little bit because It can barely fit my old retainer, my teeth remained the same, but it doesn't really fit. My jaw became a little bit stronger for sure, especially jaw muscles on the left side of the face (left side is the side that has maxilla pushed back). I have corrected my body posture, but I'm still struggling to correct my forward head posture (it's going better and better).
Finally the questions!
1. How can I know if the whole tongue is on the roof of my mouth?
2. When I'm mewing I sometimes try to push hard and for example, I think I, in order to put tongue on the roof of my mouth somehow end up using my jaw muscles (when I do that there's a huge bulge under my chin which is I guess my tongue?) So, should I keep pressing with this muscle under my chin because it kinda feels right but I'm not exactly sure about that (I know this question could be dumb but I can post pictures of my profile while im pressing with this muscle and while I'm not so you could maybe see better from pictures what I'm talking about.
3. When trying to keep perfect oral posture some random nose and lip muscle start twitching sometimes and even my jaw starts shaking uncontrollably while trying to keep the oral posture perfect. Is that twitching normal, or?
4. How can I keep my posture good at night? Sometimes it seems like a loop, throughout the day I make some progress and then in the morning the progress disappears because I can't keep pushing with my whole tongue while I'm sleeping and that *s up my progress I guess.
5. My intermolar width is about 40mm, is that narrow or?
This is a long ass post, but I had to write it down. I feel like I'm going through something serious totally unprepared and I would love to know more about orthotropics and what things are wrong on my face. I would love to post pictures if someones is willing to analyze and explain what's happening with my face.
1. tip of your tongue should be barely behind the start of your upper teeth but not touching them. you should have the back of your tongue up far enough so it blocks your airway. you can test this by keeping your teeth closed but your lips open and attempt to breath in and out. if you can't = good
2. your tongue and jaw are meant to oppose each other with their forces to create balance. if your tongue pressure is causing your jaw to open simply increase your jaw force and vice versa. teeth should never be clenched but held lightly together or barely open. idk about if you can go wrong with too much tongue pressure.
3. sounds like undeveloped muscles just having a spasm to me. it should definitely decrease with time. go buy some gum and chew hard. you may be applying more force than you're capable of atm
4. no mouth breather is capable of sleeping with proper oral posture early on. it takes quite a long time to develop the habit, strength and skill to do it while sleeping. i'd recommend chewing gum a lot to build up strength so it doesn't require as much "effort" when unconscious and just keep practicing during the day. if you don't want to you can look into buying something like a palate expander or something to hold your jaw closed, but I know little about those things. apparently they can really help you develop your face though they discourage maintaining proper posture i.e when you eventually stop losing them you won't be capable of doing proper posture whilst you're asleep i.e you lose or slow down gains. you could try learning to sleep on your back (which is the proper way to sleep) with a few pillows elevating your head. this causes a chin tuck which makes breathing through your nose easier and also assists the jaw being shut + proper tongue position
5. that sounds like plenty. I think dr. Mew recommends like 38mm to be able to do it without device assistance or compromised posture techniques. I think I have around 39-40 also and am already noticing this expanding as much tongues sides push the teeth apart
pretty much all standard questions and experiences, bro. don't fret it too much. cheers
e: in regards to your poor head/neck posture; check this out https://youtu.be/2xSlX7n-IHw and any other similar videos
1) Mew's "cheesy smile" is a good exercise to get the feel for raising the posterior tongue to the roof of your mouth.
2) I'm having trouble visualizing the bulge you are describing. When I lift my tongue on the roof of my mouth, it raises up the soft tissue so that it is concave under my chin.
3) Jaw tremor can be a marker of sleep bruxism. If touching your top and bottom central incisors together causes your teeth to chatter, you might suspect that you grind your teeth at night.
4) I'm still struggling with this myself, but the more you practice correct oral posture during the day it becomes second nature and persists during sleep. There are some training appliances that are supposed to help with this.
5) 40mm between your first molars is probably less than your genetic potential, but it is wide enough that you should be able to make progress through oral posture alone if you are consistent. Mine is 34mm, so it's harder to fit my tongue on my palate.
2. When I'm mewing I sometimes try to push hard and for example, I think I, in order to put tongue on the roof of my mouth somehow end up using my jaw muscles (when I do that there's a huge bulge under my chin which is I guess my tongue?) So, should I keep pressing with this muscle under my chin because it kinda feels right but I'm not exactly sure about that (I know this question could be dumb but I can post pictures of my profile while im pressing with this muscle and while I'm not so you could maybe see better from pictures what I'm talking about.
2) I'm having trouble visualizing the bulge you are describing. When I lift my tongue on the roof of my mouth, it raises up the soft tissue so that it is concave under my chin.
I'm very curious, as I also get this bulge. When I lift or suck to keep my tongue on my roof, my chin becomes concave, but when I push up with my tongue trying to get to the sphenoid, under my chin feels more convex, especially if I apply more pressure using the mid and anterior parts of my tongue. Could it be the digastric muscle?
I've been questioning my technique for a little while, as when I hold this position I look like I have a double chin. My hope was that it was just skin and under-worked muscles and that it would improve over time as my mandible moved forward and things tightened through proper use, but now I'm beginning to wonder if there's a better way I should be doing this.
If you're doing the chin tuck while you lift your tongue it can give that double-chin appearance.
If you're doing the chin tuck while you lift your tongue it can give that double-chin appearance.
Definitely something to keep in mind! But for the "bulge", this is definitely tongue muscle activation with mewing.
I'm not so concerned, as everywhere I've read about fixing forward head posture and facial exercises is that the relaxed double-chin look does smooth out over a few months of active exercising. I guess we'll see!
Looking in the mirror, I see that lifting my tongue to the roof of my mouth makes the soft tissue close to my neck concave as I had described, but the area immediately behind my chin remains neutral or maybe becomes slightly more convex. This is also the tissue that gives me the double-chin appearance when I do an exaggerated chin tuck. Is this the "bulge" you're talking about? If so, I don't think it's a cause for concern with regard to correct oral posture form.
@apollo -- yes, that is it exactly for me. Lately, I've been feeling the soft tissue "suck" up more into my throat, as if my hyoid bone is lifting, so I do believe this is progress. I also think it will minimize with a more forward mandible.
@guiltysidechick - does this feel like the same thing?
Hello! I have been noticing a similar problem too. When i touch the tongue to the roof of my mouth. A small bulge below where the jaw ends appears. This appears on both the sides. I've been guessing if it's a soft tissue or a gland or something.i believe I'm doing the correct tongue posture. I fear that by doing this the bulge will slowly grow and give me a double chin. Please help
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